Like all here the veil has intrigued me so much and I find that scene in the book such a powerful moment, JK's ability to put the reader there with the 6 of them was amazing. There's an author called Terry Goodkind my current read at the moment and he has written the sword of truth series quite a brilliant wizard saga over 11 books, anyway book 2 of the series called Stone of tears is all about the torn veil and how Richard the main character doesn't mend the veil everyone will be lost to the underworld where a dark wizard called darken Roule lives. This book really ads everything we thought about in the veil in OOTP and that the otherside is death and all those voices calling out to those that have some connection from one form to another. I think to go on... is to go to heaven like a good soul like Harry had that choice in Kins Cross and the veil is the entry point for the good, the bad and the ugly....

Melissa, I'm very grateful for all this vault 27 stuff- the tidbits are extremely interesting! But what I am curious about is why was the veil in the Ministry of Magic in the first place? I mean, it's not like it actually has a place it should be, it's just that it would seem a bit more likely to find it on a mysterious mountaintop or something... I dunno hehe... but that is a bit strange that the ministry has it, isn't it?

i think i might be missing the point sometimes, but seriously, what about the animals? hedwig? possibly fang? where do they go?

(and as i previously posted on the fist vault section- where was hedwig when harry went to face voldemort in book 7?)

What I'd like to know is where they found the veil. Where it comes from.

I believe the voices behind/beyond the veil can only be heard by those who have had experience with deaths. Also, they would have to accept death and realize that it will come.
I'm sorry if this doesn't contribute much. I only read the "More About the Veil" and the first 2 comments. Also I'm only 12 years old. However, I started reading the HP books when I was in 2nd grade and finished when HP 7 came out the summer before I went into 6th grade. I'm in 7th grade now and have read and re-read all of the HP books so many times that I have lost count. I know and understand pretty much everything that can be understood from the books, so I know what I'm talking about.

I really liked this--it got me thinking! I always did feel that the veil was a separation between life and death, but also a connection. I felt that the voices were herd by those who were willing to open up to them because they accepted death. Though other people may disagree, I think that Luna is a very special and brilliant character. Although she is a little quirky, she seems to understand things that others don't and is a very accepting person, which would enable her to hear the voices. Harry is still at this point having trouble accepting death (his parents and Sirius)and the possibilities that go along with it, so he doesn't hear them as clearly. I agree fully with Gabrella about Sirius and the veil.

the veil room is described as looking like one of the "courtroom in which harry had been tried" so the logical if not twisted use for the room could have been corporal punishment witht the added benifit of study for there morbid curiosity. I base this theory on our own past for our world used criminal which were put to death were then used as cadavers in medical schools for studies.

I'm not saying it's beeing continued now but mybe in the past who knows...

I've always thought the voices were that of the dead. As to why some people hear them more clearly I think relies upon one's faith, as Jo said. I think death on the whole is more faith-based than anything else in the sense that we all know we die, but which of us really have the faith (and courage) to go beyond and truly accept it? Harry was willing to accept, Luna had already accepted it (she said it was "all right" about her Mum, that she missed her sometimes but life went on). Ron can't accept death, I don't think. His character just doesn't seem to have that kind of capacity. Hermione is probably the one that kind of stumped me though. I thought out of them all she would be able to hear the voices because of her thought process. She can assign the Veil with death, can recognise its danger but denies the voices. I'm sure she heard more than she (and Jo) let on.

I dont exactly know what the whispers of the veil could mean but maybe the whispers represent the afterlife, its so confusing and there is know way to know if its real or not or indeed what it even is. Maybe the whole department of mysteries is based on that question. All I can say is, we all live in a world where we know much but we do not know much at all. Really curiousity is what makes us all human.

I think this really makes sense, because Harry has obviously grown up with death always present, so it would make sense for him to be more attuned to that sort of thing. Obviously Luna can hear then because, well she's Luna, it's her sort of thing, but i think Luna has a very strong, almost faith, if you like thst there is an afterlife, it's like the way she always insists that crumple horned snorkacks exist. And with he thestrals, i've always thought that maybe the reason Luna is so fond of thestrals is maybe because they remind her of her mother, she almsot feels connected to her through them. Then again, that's just my personal view.

This is all very interesting to me, because from the moment I read about the veil for the first time, I envisioned it as a divide between life and death. Not because of what happened when Sirius fell through it--no, the first time we saw it in the Order of the Phoenix. It reminded me instantly of the veil in the tabernacle of the Old Testament; the divide between the holy place and the most holy place--the part where God dwelled and which no priest could ever pass through. The veil of the Old Testament represented the divide between God and humanity, and the New Testament mentions that the moment Jesus died on the cross, the veil ripped in two: a clear symbolic indication that that divide had been destroyed and no longer kept apart the holy, living God and his sinful, (and therefore spiritually dead), people.

Now I don't know if Jo had any intention of alluding to the Bible at all, and I know that she mostly likely didn't; but I find this connection fascinating just the same.

That is really fascinating. I like that mostly because when it comes to the afterlife, I firmly believe in one. I love thought of the spiritual world being physical. The fact that Harry hears the voices out of sensitivity makes a lot of sense. That's so simple. =D

Thank you Melissa and Jo.

The first time I heard that people were unsure of what the veil was, it was very odd to me, because I equated it with a veil between life and death from the very first second it was mentioned in book five. Now that I know there was a lot of debate about this, I'm glad to know my thinking was right.

I'm also glad to hear Jo's description of Ginny's awareness being attributed to her connection to Harry. It's not surprising, though, that there did have to be some sort of onnection between them, when you think that, if Harry had just known how to get onto Platform 9 3/4 by himself, he wouldn't have needed Molly's help, might never have been as close to Ron, and Ginny probably wouldn't have had that entire year to think about her crush on "the boy who lived."

Knowing everything I know now about the series, all the little details that turn out to be major plot pieces, I realize that Jo isn't just a great writer, she's got a truly astonishing imagination, and her ability to put that into words so magnificently is absolutely amazing.

i comment so much on this on my new blog. screwreallife.livejournal.com. check it out. you might be interested. :-)

Wow! Love this discussion. I am also embarrassed of my lack of accuracy concerning Sirius’s death in my earlier comment. Perhaps I was so in shock and denial when I was reading that I couldn’t accept that he was really gone. I was grasping so hard at any evidence to the contrary that I must have just completely over looked the whole green light thing! I can’t even bring myself to go back and read the passage to get it straight in my head. This is going to sound completely insane but Gabrella’s comments and the discussion over the veil help put some closure on his death for me. I think having fallen through the veil and not leaving a body behind made his death hard to accept. Like Harry, I just had to accept his death on faith and I wasn’t really willing to do that. But Gabrella is completely correct that his story was essentially over. His existence was tied so tightly to James that he really couldn’t exist without him. His whole life in Azkaban focused entirely on finding Peter. Even after his escape he was never really free. Sirius never even got a chance to grow up (he was what 21/22 when he was imprisoned?). He was never really whole, just a fractured version of his former self, teetering on the brink of insanity. I’m sure death offered Sirius the freedom he so longed for and deserved. The veil offered a peaceful passage over. Thanks for putting that into perspective, Gabrella.

What I kind of think, especially with Jo's new information about it, is that the veil is a kind of representation of Jo and many people's confusion about death and the afterlife. It separates the world of the living and the dead, but it's not a clear transparent thing, because the Unspeakables obviously study it a lot, and try to find out more about the veil. The whole Department of Mysteries is basically delving into these areas of philosophy and science and spirituality, like Time, Death, Love, etc. But I don't think they can ever truly understand them. It's like you cannot find out what death is until Death greets you one fine day himself.

The whispers are, to me, like how well you understand death, and how close you are to truly knowing and "mastering" death.

Wow, I can not wait to read the book, Melissa! And thanks so much for giving us all these little tidbits you couldn't include. I loved the veil scenes in the book. I assumed, as was confirmed, that the reason some heard and others didn't was because of their own experiences with death in some way. It made perfect sense that Luna and Harry would hear, Ron would be afraid, and Hermione would be too preoccupied with rational, present circumstances to think about it. In response to Mjoy's question, why does the veil exist? As it relates to Sirius, I think when I first read OotP, I was stunned by his sudden death and disappearance behind the veil. But as I look back now, I find it fitting that he passed over in this way. For one thing, it made it real. He was totally gone, and Harry had to accept that he wasn't there anymore. But I also think that for Sirius, a man who had lost his very best friends to death, had spent a soul-numbing decade in Azkaban, and had been left feeling sort of an unnecessary person after that (due to his having to be in hiding), the veil was a fitting and welcome end. And on the flip side, I imagine Sirius would have welcomed death in his state in OotP. I think that besides Harry (and hermione and Rob to a degree) there wasn't much left for him in life. The veil brought him back to his former glory, if you will.

I'm glad that a lot of questions about the veil were answered, although I do have a question for discussion. Why is that veil located in the Ministry of Magic? I understand that it's in the Department of Mysteries, but how many people knew about the veil before the Order and the Death Eaters showed up there and exposed it? During the corruption of the Ministry in the seventh book, did the Death Eaters use the veil to get rid of people as absolutely as possible? Is the veil still there now? Thanks.

Great post, Melissa. Your observations are thought-provoking.

In my first read of OotP, my thoughts equated the the Veil to the veil of the Holy of Holies in the Jerusalem temple and the whisperings beyond to those that might occur from the "great cloud of witnesses" described in the Scriptures. When Sirius fell through the veil, he was already dead from Bellatrix's AK. However, the fact of his disappearance behind the veil (and one wonders which side of the stone arch was *front* in the first place) gives pause to think of the OT prophet Elijah's disappearance into the clouds on the great chariot...he was never seen again!

I truly enjoyed reading this chapter with the rich, symbolic descriptions of the veil-room. The Department of Mysteries is so-rightly named.

Instead of asking what the veil is, I wonder if we should be asking why it exists. Why does it exist in terms of the magical world of Harry Potter and in terms of literary device? I’m really curious to know what inspired JKR to create this veil. What purpose does it serve to have Sirius die in this way rather than just by the Avada Kedavra curse or some more conventional way? Every other character, as far as I can recall at this moment, directly dies at the hands of Volermort or Death Eaters. Sirius’s was sort of an empty death because of falling through the veil. If anyone knows of an interview or place where she addresses these questions, I’d really like to know. Thanks.

Wow! This is a fantastic piece - and it makes me even more excited to read your book. I had always thought of being able to hear the veil (like seeing the Thestrals) as somehow experiencing and being close to death. The spiritual / faith connection isn't one I had thought about, but it really does make sense. Hermione is definitely one who I could see wouldn't have the "faith" to hear life after death. That might be something that develops in her later. Neville must have some sort of faith (as maybe JKR) that all of this isn't the end - that his parents will be restored in the afterlife, like those people JKR met in Amnesty International. Luna is one of those characters who just believes - sometimes I wish I had that kind of faith, but I am too much of a Hermione for that. I do wonder about Ron though- he didnt' really act scared of the veil in that scene, but maybe he was scared of thinking about the afterlife, or didn't really think of it at all - he is also very practical (though not in teh same way as Hermione).

Some authors have shown death in a less shrouded way- in the C.S. Lewis's the "Last Battle" and even in "Dawn Treader" and "Silver Chair" Aslan's Country is more real than anything the children have experienced, bigger on the inside than the outside. But it is not a place they can stay in until it is their time. You get the feeling that it is very wild and very beautiful and very raw and very *real*.

However, in these books, I like the fact that the afterlife is shrouded in mystery. JKR shows me through these that she believes, but sometimes she doubts and sometimes it is hard. To me, *that* is even more real. Faith that is still real, but still doubts and wonders and perseveres.

Didn't realise there was such a debate about the veil. To me it always made sense that it was a veil between life and death, perhaps its because my mind has always been on paranormal things and the afterlife, more so since i lost my younger brother.
To me it wouldn't make much sense throwing sticks and stones through the veil. These are inanimate things and don't have souls, surely they'd just pass through and come out the other side? As religion tells us that the afterlife is the place the soul goes onto when the body fails.
Maybe the veil also acts as something that destroys matter as it passes through? That could explain why Sirius' body was never retrieved.

Very interesting piece Melissa, thank you for sharing.

One comment of Hermione--she will always grab onto the rational because it is safe to her. The known is where she is comfortable--she may believe but her fear will make her reach to the known first--rather than the unknown.

Eva Hedwig wrote: ‘I don't think that most of the ring users would have known about this secret.’

I didn’t intend to say that the owners of the ring after Ignotus Peverell knew about the Resurrection Stone. Perhaps some did, but the (last) Gaunts certainly didn’t - but that doesn’t mean they never turned the stone three times unintentionally. I keep fiddling with my rings all the time (nothing extraordinary has happened so far). What I wanted to say: I suspect if Hermione had turned the Resurrection Stone three times, there’s a good chance nothing would have happened.

As a previous poster this was all obvious to me from my first reading in Order :D . I was surprised to find a fandom out there with wild theories on it, it always seemed straightforward to me.

I have enjoyed reading others' comments. Looking forward to buying your book Melissa. If it is half as interesting as what you post here, I won't be able to put it down until I have finished it. Thank you for discussion.

Hummerhorn wrote: " I suspect the Resurrection Stone would work similarly: Generations of wizards wore that Gaunt Ring and never noticed it is able to ‘resurrect’ people: because they did not believe in it!"
-----

I don't think that most of the ring users would have known about this secret. Maybe there was a tabu arround it in the Peverell's familiy.

Imagine: the first owner who created the stone commited suicide, when he could not bring his loved one back to live. He chose to die to be truly united with her again.

So the stone would not be easy to use, the moment you turn him in your hand you move your destiny in relation with the dead ones. You need a very strong caracter for this. Even DD found his own dead when daring to use it.

Remember when DD told Harry to not linger too much in front of the mirror Erised, that he should go on with live. And: Harry only could master the Patronus Charm when he decided to not listen to his death parents voices again. He had to turn arround to focus on the affairs of the living, the same like with Erised.

Not to speak about when Harry finaly used the stone, beeing very clear in his purpose. So it didn't affected him. DD told him in King's Cross that he wanted to be sure that when Harry used the stone he would know how to master it.

You have whetted my appetite! I can't wait to read more.

Thank you for this Melissa. I can not wait to read your book!

As for the Veil, when I was reading it the first time, a phrase I must have heard somewhere in my life came to mind. And it is simply the "veil between life and death". I don't know where I heard that, but it stuck to me. So I felt very comfortable that Sirius had made a peaceful journey to the other side.

Now, I know he had just been murdered. But, in muggle reality, I do not believe that people who meet their end in violent or upsetting ways pass to the afterlife in an unsettled or angry state. I think they just, in an instant, pass on.I feel it is a peaceful process..the battle over.

I think that whether or not one can hear the voices, and the clarity, depends on how much one longs to hear them. Harry and Luna both have a longing to hear their loved ones again. And so they are open to it, hoping and even perhaps on some level, expecting to hear them. Hermione, does not because she has, really, no voices to listen for.

I do just want to add a thought here about the references made to "Christian allegory" in the books. I am not a Christian, so I can not draw direct literal parellels to the New Test. I would not notice them if they were there.

However, I feel the themes of the books are relatable to a wide spectrum of religious/spiritual beliefs and experiences. Almost all people, at sometime or another, wrestle with good and evil, what happens after I die, how to deal with grief and loss, and all of the other questions in JKR's writing.

It's great to have this extra reflection on the veil. I'm taken with your insight that authors are all wary of going beyond "the veil". I'm reminded of C.S. Lewis's book "The Great Divorce" which in one way explores the afterlife but in another the action takes place on the very edges of heaven - just as in the Narnia Chronicles he has people enter the afterlife in "The Last Battle" but the real destination is further on beyond his description.

How amazingly thought provoking! I cannot convey the excitement I feel in anticipating the release of Harry a History since reading the Vault: 27 entries (Melissa’s plan no doubt)! As, for the veil, I thought always that the voices from the veil alluded to the idea that "the ones we love never really leave us" as said by Sirius in the movie Prisoner of Azkaban (but wasn't it said by someone else in the book)? Anyway, JKR often refers to the idea that despite death, our loved ones are always there with us, usually in our darkest hour when we need them the most. It is in our darkest hour that our heart calls to them the hardest and listens for them the hardest. The voices through the veil suggest that the barrier between life and death is not a solid fixture, rather semi-permeable allowing the connection forged in life between people to remain. And then it always goes back to love doesn’t it? Love is the over arching theme of the series. Love, the most powerful form of magic, cannot be blocked even by the veil.

Very nice. Thank you, Melissa.

I always thought of the Department of Mysteries as the Wizarding World's Philosophy Department. Just like us, they question: What is death, what is love, time, space, human intelligence... And just like us, they do not know the answers to these questions and never will.

I think this underlines one of Jo's themes that I have a hard time putting into words. That human beings are human beings no matter where you find them. They are good, bad, intelligent, stupid, brave, weak, giving, selfish, etc. We are all very similiar under our skins. We care and worry about the same things.

Another way she emphasizes this is in the opening chapter of book 6. Remember "The Other Minister" which she said she wanted use in several other books? While I think she liked the contrast, politics, and comedy of it, I think she most liked the end.

"But for heaven's sake - you're wizards! You can do magic! Surely you can sort out - well - anything!"

..."The trouble is, the other side can do magic too, Prime Minister" (HBP p. 24)

People are people, no matter where you find them.

I don't know why, but Jo's explanation about the veil was very obvious to me when I read OotP. I always wondered why others didn't get it, and instead read into theories that weren't there. *I am not a smart man* (to be read in a Forrest Gump voice), but the veil room was perfectly understandable to me. Maybe it was because I have lost someone very close to me as Jo did, or maybe I was just lucky to have guessed correctly: hard telling.

I am looking forward to reading your book Melissa, and as I said before, I am so proud of you! You've worked hard, put in the hours, and created something wonderful and unique. Kudos! (I'm old, and I feel like your my kid or something. Grant me my senility, please; I just may pinch your cheeks if I ever meet you!)

Thanks, Melissa. It is nice to have the concept of the veil confirmed. What happens to the body? Where does it go? More questions, I know. Maybe you have an idea?

I hate the thought that the Veil is something living that devours instead of a one way barrier to a different dimension (in this case, the afterlife).

Thank you very much Melissa. I loved the exerpt in many ways. What strikes me most is JKR's own admission of a strong faith in going on, and that this faith is as challenged by doubts as it is strong. At least that is the way I read the answers in text. Can you elaborate? What do you think Jo means by that. And...what clarity of voices would Jo hear next to the veil? I wonder about what I would hear, but moreso, reading the dialogue above....I wonder what Jo would hear, too. And how would you respond to a veil experience, Melissa?

I too thought the room was an execution room, and the voices behind the veil were there to lure people in.
I guess I'm too old to be too curious as to what lies behind, but I too wanted Harry to have a look just in case Sirius was realy still there and could be dragged back.
The place - "King's Cross Station - is, to me, a place of meditation, where - emptied of all irelevant thoughts you can have a look at what's important, much like a memory pensieve, I guess.

Very insightful. I've only just begun to look past JKR's amazing story-telling abilities and find the nuggets of gold in the books; they mean so much more than 'that's just a good story.' She is able to relate to the audience in such a way that it causes the audience to think about real, true-life questions such as death, an afterlife, and why bad things happen to good people as well as bad. She doesn't answer any of the questions directly... which is fine, because sometimes there are just no answers to those questions. But it makes this story so human, so relatable.
I look forward to reading Harry, a History.

I must be a bit of a ghoul, because it never occured to me this room of the Veil was a place of study or, to some extent, worship. On reading Phoenix, I'd assumed this room was an execution chamber and my mind immediately turned to speculations on crime and punishment.

How wrong I was!

Very much looking forward to the book!

Perdie

Hi!

Wow, that’s fascinating. But it sounds very logical. I suspect the Resurrection Stone would work similarly: Generations of wizards wore that Gaunt Ring and never noticed it is able to ‘resurrect’ people: because they did not believe in it!

As for King’s Cross in Harry’s head, I suppose it is a sort of limbo, on the threshold of death, a tugging at the veil: a glance beyond. I do think it is the spirit/soul of Dumbledore himself, who ‘comes out of the afterlife’ to advise Harry: either to go on or to return. I suppose everyone who dies experiences something essentially similar: being picked up and escorted beyond the veil by someone who reassures him.

As for the Tolkien reference: Frodo’s journey in the White Ship is not exactly directly to death, but to the earthly paradise – in that place he would be healed and would then *afterwards* die! But there is a reference to real death in LotR: Gandalf says ‘I strayed out of memory and time’ – he left the world, meaning to say he died.

Very best wishes, Hummerhorn

Thanks for that explanation Melissa!

I always thought the experiments about death were attempts to call people back from death. From as early as book 1 (with Dumbledore & Harry in teh hospital wing) we know that wizards, just like muggles, are often afraid of death. That many of them, Harry & Dumbledore included, would give anything for one last conversation with a dead loved one. Now add to this what we know about one man who was able to place a charm, perhaps, on a stone so that the stone could call these people back. It couldn't bring them through the veil, but could get them close enough so that you could see them and speak to them. Since DH, I've thought that the unspeakables were trying to do something similar: attempting to get the souls of the deceased close enough to be questioned.

I always thought it was related to how close someone had come to death, and how much they... excepted death. Does that make sense? How much they dont fear it... how real it was to them. Harry and Ginny had both come close to death in their lives that it was a real thing to them (not to mention how Harry had lost so many loved ones). Luna had seen her mother die. Ron and Hermione on the other hand, had never been that close. I assumed they were both so afraid of death that that's why they couldnt (wouldnt) hear the voices.

I just long for another Potter book really to get stuck into, although I've been rereading them all in the past few months. Funnily enough I only finished OotP yesterday and had been pondering about this veil. I thought it was that it was the openness to faith and the afterlife which determined what people hear and how clearly.

W-O-W!

I read this earlier this morning and have just reread it and still, I found this article utterly mind-boggling! But still, W-O-W!!! More, PLEASE MELISSA! More, more, more!!!

And as for Luna, I always saw her asthe most open-minded out of everyone, plus she did see her Mother die, which is why I thought she could hear the whispers. But, that's my theorgy and I'm sticking to it!

Thanks again, Melissa! Andy ;)

To me it's more curious what lies behind another door in the department of mysteries. Well we know what it is: Love, the strongest magic in the world. And the door is the means to escape this world (which is illusion according to many sources)into the Reality. It would have been interesting to say more about it in the books: how does one get into the room? What is it like to experience being there etc.? And if I had to choose I'd walk through that other door.

ia

Thanks for sharing that, Melissa. I think that must be the hardest thing in writing a book, that moment when you have to cut something that you really like, and that you know readers will find interesting.

Jo pretty much explained the Veil the way I understood it when I read (and reread) Order of the Phoenix.I was very pleased with the way some of the characters could hear whispers or sensed that there was more than the physical arch and veil. Life, and consequently death, are full of mysteries that we can never unravel, and the veil was one that points to some of them believing or wanting to believe in an after-life.

And I'm very glad that she was clear that the Veil was the separation between life and death and not the cause of death. I remember that being the point of view of quite a few people during the early discussions of OP.

At first it bothered me that we never got answers to just what the Ministry was studying in all the rooms, but then I realized that it was much better that Jo left those topics as mysteries that Harry wasn't going to understand or learn about, and neither were we. Life and death and love and how intelligence actually works and how it all fits with time and space are full of mystery. There are just some things that we can't disect and put under a microscope to analyze. And it's that mystery that gives us the beauty of our world.

Pat

Wow! This is really interesting to me and I love this explaination. I never thought of it like this.

I was really disapointed when we never went back to the department of mysteries or found out anything about the veil or the love room because that's one part of the books that I absolutly love. However, I think the reason why I love it so much is because it is such a mystery. I'm actually glad she leaves so much of that open because it's so interesting to speculate on.

This was awesome and so are you Melissa!

Ahhh! Thank you, Melissa! This is a fantastic bit of "canon thump." Interesting about Hermione. Yes, we all know that she's logical to the last; but I felt in Deathly Hallows that she had something of faith or whatever you will call it but that she struggled. She believes in the lasting soul and knows the verse on James and Lily's grave; was scared of pulling back the dead. These things from Jo are what make me think that people who say she's anti-Christian are silly. If you know what to look for its there.

Melissa,

Thank you for this tidbit. I've been wanting to hear from JKR on The Veil since I read about it. That whole scene, with the seats all assembled around The Veil, was so creepy and evocative, I couldn't get it out of my mind. Actually, even after reading your little tidbit, I still want to know more! But it was great to hear and read it. I am so stoked about the book!

Eric Bowling

I might have made a typo on the skeptical thing; I'll check the audio. :) But I don't think there's any doubt of Luna's question of faith.

Um Luna is the skeptical one? She seems like whatever the oposite of skeptical is according to the description here. I would peg Hermione as the skeptical one. Am I misunderstanding something?

Luna IS a skeptical character, or she isn't? That statement read odd to me.

Thanks for sharing the interview:) It's really interesting.
About the sticking sticks and things through the veil..What if you put part of a plant that's still alive partly through the veil and then get it out again. I wonder if it has partially died or if that part has just disappeared..
Or the whole plant dies. Or the whole plant gets sucked into it (that's kindoff creepy).
~evanna

Melissa:
"I still wonder what kind of study wizards undertake, sitting in an ampitheatre around that veil. John thinks they send sticks and stones through the veil to see what happens. But, really, there's an element of realism in that question: don't they realize fairly quickly that anything they stick in there is not going to come back?"

Me:
Exactly. As I read Jo's thoughts on this (and thank you very much for bringing them to us, Melissa), I wonder if the Unspeakables in the Death Room are not studying the dead but rather the living -- who hears the murmurs from beyond the veil clearly, who hears only indistinct whispers, who hears nothing, and why. Perhaps they're not investigating the process of death, but the faith of the living.

Of course, for those who can hear the voices clearly, I'll bet they're also studying the content of what is said. What conversations, what soliloquies -- what Mysteries would these eavesdroppers on the Afterlife hear? Would the voices speak in ways we could understand, or would they sound like prophecies? Would anything intelligible come across the divide, or are things just too different over there for any of us to relate to?

I like the fact that Jo never got concrete about what exactly lay beyond the Veil. I suspect that everyone encountering that distant land sees something different; "this is, as they say, your party," as Dumbledore quips at King's Cross. So no one authorial description could ever really get across the essence of the Veilly World. Better to let all of our imaginations, spurred on by a few suggestive hints from Jo, run wild.

We dance round in a ring and suppose,
But the Secret sits in the middle and knows.
--Robert Frost

What I admire is the way Jo writes these veil and after death scenes with open interpretations. The Kings Cross scene can be interpreted literally as an after death experience with the real spiritual Dumbledore, or it may simply be all in Harry's head, or my own personal interpretation that it was all in Harry's head with a spiritual influence or intervention. I like Jo's interpretation of the voices in the veil. She "thinks" the clarity of the voices correlates to how much you have associated with death and to some extent, how much you fear it. The thing is, even Jo is not certain, she interprets it this way but is not all together sure. Just as she "felt" Dumbledore is gay and machiavellian, or she "thinks" Kings Cross was an after death experience, she writes these complex characters and scenes but then speculates what kind of person these characters are or what some scenes mean as much as we the reader does. Its brilliant writing but I believe it is because Jo freely admits she is in constant conflict with her own beliefs - that leads to her writing some damn interesting literature! Of course the books (especially Deathly Hallows) are sprayed with Christian anecdotes, morals, and beliefs which I am very happy about as a great story for me lies in its strength of moral regardless of which religious inclination it takes. Thank you Melissa for that precious book edit cut, and your opinion piece article is worthy of an entry in the essays section of the Leaky site!

That´s great!! Thank you Melissa!!

I always wondered that the characters could hear those whispers in the Veil as close they had come to death, too.

And this explanation from Jo seems to confirm it for me.

I can´t wait for 4 November and discover others cannon details!!

Frankly I dunnno. I always felt the whispers were the dead calling to the living. The veil was that undefinable 'place' between life and death. I got that part from the books. R. A. Heinlein's character Lazaus Long said "There is no conclusive evidence of life after death. But there is no evidence of any sort against it. Soon enough you will _know_. So why fret about it."
I guess that's where I stand too.

OMT